Last night we had a rally
It was pretty sweet. James Faris came up and talked about thanksgiving. Not as in the holiday, but as in giving thanks to God. We made a list of like 27-28ish different biblical reasons for thanking God. Very Cool. After the rally I drove back to Indy and got waylaid as I tried to sneak through the door. Then I stayed up way to late and got up way to early to be good for anyone. I've been thinking about something the last couple week and James mentioned it at the beginning of his talk so I'm going to give a little space to it now. >>> Seems that the god of christmas and his ever seductively beautiful goddess of materalism have a greater grasp on the hearts and minds of Americans than ever before. Even last year I made it at least through Thanksgiving before I had to quit listening to the radio because of their blasphemous commercials exlating the great giver, yes lord santa himself, above all and blantantly abusing the name of my Savior. ~going to breakfast~ might write more later.
9 Comments:
Just to note, that these are Josh's thoughts and not my own - I do like the fact that Thanksgiving is much less materialistic than Christmas, other than perhaps the food aspect. I smell an interesting discussion about the nature and propriety of Christmas coming up here, however.
correct. I should have said that all James said was that the world is losing intrest in Thanksgiving aka turkey day. I don't believe that he's a cynical christmas-hater like myself.
That's right. I'm not an antichristmasentarian. That said, Christmas shouldn't rule the Christian Church - especially in worship since it is not prescribed by God. But, there is nothing wrong with celebrating God's mighty acts as cultural holidays, just as Jesus celebrated the extra-biblical feast of Dedication in John 10. It has been argued that Christmas has been so abused and misused through the ages that we should not try to "sanctify" it - that was generally the view of the reformers. But, if we're going to say that, then we need to do things like rename all the days of the week and our months as well. They are all pagan in nature too.
The Christmas stuff is bugging me too....a Christmas tree appeared in the basement of my dorm building tonight...my friends in drawing class were discussing what Christmas carols they listened to over the weekend...aaaaaah! I am definately an antichristmastarian. We should have an antixmas party when CORPS does their thing.
I agree with James that there are ways to celebrate Christmas without celebrating it the way the world does. I also deplore the materialism and excess of Christmas (witness the decorations and Santas up before the end of October this year - totally nuts!). In my family, we celebrated Christmas as Jesus' birthday. We knew that it wasn't really Jesus' birthday, but just a day to celebrate his birth, like the way some kids have their birthday parties on days that aren't their real birthdays. Since my brother and I were both born in December, we didn't do big presents on Christmas (that being reserved for birthdays) but we did have a birthday cake for Jesus.
We also had a neat tradition called the Jesse Tree, wherein for family devotions during December we covered a different step from creation to Jesus' birth in Jesus' family tree (based on the verse about the Messiah coming from the root of Jesse, David's father).
Anyway, all this to say that I do think there are ways to have Christmas without being worldly about it.
Halloween, however, is another matter. I'm an anti-Halloweentarian absolutely. Now that I've said that, maybe my husband will weigh in on the discussion, since we recently had a lot of talks about both Halloween and Christmas as "holidays."
(Note: these are the opinions of Josh Gillespie. They do not represent, nor do I speak on behalf of, Josh Bright, Catherine Gillespie, James Faris or blogger.com. I am soley responsible for my content.)
I guess I will post here too. I will start by saying that I'm not anti-Christmas, or anti-halloween. This is because, like my wife, my family had different traditions for each day.
First for halloween. This day means something completely different to me because Oct. 31 is my mom's birthday. Sure I dressed up (as Bubba Phet one year) and I went trick 'r treating. But my mom liked taking me trick 'r treating. This was one way we celebrated her birthday. That's how I saw the day. That may sound lame, but it's the truth.
Christmas was different. My dad was a pastor as I was growing up, so when it came to celebrating Christmas, our family knew it was about Christ. We had stolen in the morning (a bread/fruit cake version of swaddling clothes...I couldn't stand the stuff, but my dad liked it) and we always began our time of opening gifts with a reading of Christ's birth from Matthew or Luke and a sermonette on what Christmas was really about.
So each day means something completely different than what the world wants me to believe. But being married has brought in new and different traditions. We try to uphold each other's family tradions, but it should be fun (especially with a new baby...whenever she decides to show up) to develop our own and to raise our children with a proper understanding of each "holiday".
If we get wrapped up in what the world wants us to believe each day means, then our focus is more on what the world wants us to believe rather than Christ. As James pointed out, Jesus did celebrate extra-biblical "holidays". Now he probably didn't have to start hearing annoying carrols or see annoying decorations 6 months before that "holiday", but He (as we should) celebrated what the original intent of that day. It was a day to give Thanksgiving to God. And frankly, I don't see anything wrong with celebrating Christmas in that manner. But, that's just my opinion.
OK guys. I was going to let it sit for later in the year, but I feel a compelling need to respond. James, did Jesus celebrate the feast? from what I found it is just a setting for that particular story. Pretty weak argument there. Also, renaming the days of the week is way different than not celebrating x-mas. First of all, any Christian can easily refrain from the celebration. Secondly, I am only opposed to celebrating it, not eliminating it- you can use pagan names/celebrations (like the feast/days/months/whatever) in reference to time placement. I refer to the second day of the week as Monday because that is how that day is known, not because I worship the moon god. Also, some Christians are trying to rename the days~ calling Sunday the Sabbath is good because it removes the pagan context and still retains its useability as time reference. I think it is also importaint to note that you admittedly reject the views of many reformers. hmm....
Catherine, thanks for the comment!!! You have some very good and interesting points worth considering. That is what I will do. Off considering....
Josh, your opinions are not mine. I agree with them a lot~ your taste in music is quite good. You start however, by saying that you are led by tradition as the romanists. My father did a very difficult thing in telling both sets of my grandparents that we would not celebrate x-mas. I believe he did something quite commendable and Gideon did something commendable by brakeing down his father's idols and groves. Halloween I'm not even going to talk about. Catherine can give you the scoop on that. X-mas however is not about Christ. It started as a pagan celebration of the "rebirth" of the undying Sun, complete with roiting, drunkenness, chambering, wantonness etc... Even the Roman Catholic condemmed it outright before it lost it's true love. It was indeed a liberal Catholic priest who decided to "Christianize" this pagan feast by calling it a "holy" celebration of the birth of the Son and offering a special mass on that day. I don't have the info in front of me, but I believe that priest may have been excommmunicated. I'll look it up. Since that "Christ-mass" all people have been encouraged to fall in with the masses and start making out under the misletoe. Jesus was very fortunate that lawn ornaments had not yet been invented. Thanks for your opinion.
Further reasons I do not celebrate "Christmas":
I do not like to attach the name of my Saviour to a very materialistic holiday.(hence my use of x-mas)
I see no place where Jesus, the apostles, or the early Church celebrated or were commanded to celebrate His birth.
Yes, I do have Biblical warrant for the Holy days that I do observe.
I see x-mas as a time where a desperate people can be lured into a false since of peace about the state of their souls by the abuse of this day. i.e. "I went to church and gave to the poor on x-mas so now God will surely have mercy on me."
Ok I think I have more reasons, but it's 2AM so I'm going to bed.
First this~ While I do not see Christmas as a day to be celebrated by Christians, I am wroking hard on trying to take a Romans 14 approach to the matter. I do not despise or judge those who do, I merely see them as having different convictions as myself, and while I belive that they are mistaken, I do not see the matter as an essential part of salvation, so I will just state my opinion and reasons for it in the hopes that some will see the logic in it and convert their views, or see the illogic in it and attempt to convert my views.
Wow I should have made this a post.
Oh I forogt to mention last night that x-mas is the time of year for all Christians to take their little graven images out of the closet and proudly display them by their groves. Yes, I am talking about nativity scenes. I believe them to be a blantant abuse and disregard of the second commandment, and I will regard all who display them as -well, I was going to say something along the lines of idolater, but that was too harsh so I'll go with fellow sinner.
your views are correct and admirable & while are are forbidden to worship graven images & shouldn't, some Chrisians like the "Holiday Season". They feel heathen folk are more open to evangelism & discussions about Christ & these Christians play the Reason for the Season for all its worth & witness.
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